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The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeline

Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

Why can't Canada, instead of promoting the development of an extremely environmentally harmful development and weakening our environmental policy to facilitate its growth, take the lead in promoting a clean economy?
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You mean like build run of river projects?
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

Doesn't matter how small the effect is. An earths rotation that is just fractions of a second slower means significant changes to the distribution of the energy budget from the sun.
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I get it ... you don't have any idea what 10**20 means. It doesn't equate to fractions of a second. Unless you consider one grain of sand divided by all the grains of sand on earth to be a fraction. Ha Ha. Why don't you do the math to support your claim & get back to us.
You've already demonstrated to me that your opinions are easily debunked by basic science; and are therefore useless. IMO, if your scientific opinions are out by orders of magnitude, then you are making this garbage up without any thought or research ... so why should any of us take any of your opinions seriously?
I can probably paddle farther and faster than any of you here
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Ken V
Dude, you have no credibility at all.

PS: I'll bet you $20 I can easily scull your Solstice.
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

What we need to do is change the way we live.

Really, it is this simple.
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

It just boggles my mind how sea kayakers can present ideas that are so counter to the well being of our precious environment. Let's build a pipeline for Alberta Tar...ship the bitumen back and forth and hope that one fateful night the sea doesn't take her revenge and break up one of those double hulled never could happen super super supertankers on our precious coast. Sometimes the opinions expressed on this website just make my hair stand up. Has the sea not taught you anything about the need to take care of her.
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

:popcorn:
Yep...I'm stay'n out of these kind discussions...
:popcorn:

:mrgreen:
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

nootka said:
I get it ... you don't have any idea what 10**20 means. It doesn't equate to fractions of a second. Unless you consider one grain of sand divided by all the grains of sand on earth to be a fraction. Ha Ha. Why don't you do the math to support your claim & get back to us.
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There is zero which is not a fraction and there is one divided by infinity which is a fraction. Not even math just basic arithmetic.

Used to be that people thought BC's forest to be a limitless resource too.


Tidal movement causes a continual loss of mechanical energy in the Earth–Moon system due to pumping of water through the natural restrictions around coastlines, and due to viscous dissipation at the seabed and in turbulence. This loss of energy has caused the rotation of the Earth to slow in the 4.5 billion years since formation. During the last 620 million years the period of rotation has increased from 21.9 hours to the 24 hours[4] we see now; in this period the Earth has lost 17% of its rotational energy. While tidal power may take additional energy from the system, increasing the rate of slowdown, the effect would be noticeable over millions of years only, thus being negligible.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tidal_power
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The only part that I don't agree with is the part that says 'negligable'.
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

I'm glad to see you posting some reference material.
There is zero which is not a fraction and there is one divided by infinity which is a fraction. Not even math just basic arithmetic.
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Zero divided by infinity is undefined. No one I know would say an undefined number is a fraction.
Used to be that people thought BC's forest to be a limitless resource too.
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A good point, but I don't see the relevance. The clearcutting of BC is a function of initial coverage, cutting rate, and replanting rate. The government could have easily calculated when we would run out of trees.
The only part that I don't agree with is the part that says 'negligable'.
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Fair enough. But I think you came up with better reasons to oppose tidal power when the subject first came up.
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

Guys, please take it to PM's if you're going to continue along this vein. Your bickering at each other is not even entertaining and you've really taken this discussion way, way off topic.

If you've got more to say about the Pipedreams Project, by all means do so, but keep the personal insults and attacks to yourselves.

I'd like to hear more about the trip that this group is endeavoring upon.

Thanks.

*****
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

Thanks Dan for veering this discussion back on topic. For anyone who's interested we've now added an option to send a letter of to the Minister of Environment and other key members of Parliament on our website under the Get Involved! section. Sending letters is the bread and butter of how the public can participate in the environmental assessment process, and sending them to the Minister of Environment is key as the review panel's recommendations will be submitted to him for approval. Once the assessment is open for an official public comment period we will also direct letters to the Panel Chair.

Our project will only be successful if others take actions like this to voice their concern!

http://www.thepipedreamsproject.org/get-involved.html
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

There is an ancient right of mariners to sail upon the seas. That right is protected by a set of laws called public trust doctrine. It would be a serious matter to allow a breach in that public trust doctrine just because you don't like the cargo a ship is carrying.

Muck with the laws of public trust doctrine at your peril. There are also people who don't like kayakers paddling anywhere they please. Once the public trust doctrine is abrogated there is nothing to stop them from keeping you off their waterfront.
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

"If some drilling equipment parts are flawed, is it rational to say all are?" he asked. "Are all airplanes a danger because one was? All oil tankers like Exxon Valdez? All trains? All mines? That sort of thinking seems heavy-handed, and rather overbearing."

U.S. District Judge Martin Feldman
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill
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Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

ken_vandeburgt said:
"If some drilling equipment parts are flawed, is it rational to say all are?" he asked. "Are all airplanes a danger because one was? All oil tankers like Exxon Valdez? All trains? All mines? That sort of thinking seems heavy-handed, and rather overbearing."

U.S. District Judge Martin Feldman
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_gulf_oil_spill
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The same douche bag judge that get's paid by the oil companies. Let's see how long his credibility lasts.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/06/2 ... 21501.html
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

In response to the spill, the United States Congress passed the Oil Pollution Act of 1990 (OPA). The legislation included a clause that prohibits any vessel that, after March 22, 1989, has caused an oil spill of more than one million U.S. gallons (3,800 m³) in any marine area, from operating in Prince William Sound.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exxon_Valdez_oil_spill
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I like the idea of banning ships that have a poor safety record from places like Douglas Channel. Makes more sense than banning all tankers.

Maybe an equivalent to the Jones Act too where any tankers in Douglas Channel must be built in Canada and registered in Canada; ie no flags of convenience.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merchant_M ... ct_of_1920
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

In my web search for info on this pipeline project I came across this tanker route and oil spill simulation
http://www.livingoceans.org/programs/en ... model.aspx
Play around with it :cry:

As we passed through these coastal waters on our 2009 trip I was amazed with all the life in the water and intertidal zone, Like rons said in a earlier post "PRECIOUS"

Dave R
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

They are off and running - arrived in Kitimat and launching on Sept 1! Wishing them a great journey and a fulfilled purpose! Ryan is the son of longtime friends of mine...and I am very proud of him (them) taking on this journey! Kudoes to these three for standing up for what they believe in and making it happen! They are an inspiration to me!! :clap:

http://www.thepipedreamsproject.org/blog.html

http://www.thepipedreamsproject.org/index.html
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

I like the idea of banning ships that have a poor safety record from places like Douglas Channel. Makes more sense than banning all tankers.
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...a little (?) naive of you Ken! .....the tankers are subject to the people on the bridge i.e. human fallibility.... so why should we wish to take that risk considering whats at stake????
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

...a little (?) naive of you Ken! .....the tankers are subject to the people on the bridge i.e. human fallibility.... so why should we wish to take that risk considering whats at stake????
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I don't think its naive. Thousands of tankers transit our oceans daily without incident.
That's not to say accidents can't happen. The risk of accidents can be significantly reduced through proper safety programs; hence, banning tankers with a poor safety record is a good incentive to have safe practices in place and not just used in Douglas channel.

As pointed out earlier a similar ban is in place in Prince William Sound. There has not been a significant accident there since the oil pollution act 1990 was put in place by US Congress.

Why should we take the risk? Well, indirectly at least, oil pays our bills and feeds our families. Our lifestyle is dependant on oil. You are living in a dream world if you think otherwise. When the earth runs out of oil there will be a massive correction in world population in a matter of weeks unless viable alternatives have been developed. The risk of not getting oil to market is a higher stake risk even if you think only in terms of political instability.
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

Kasey said:
They are off and running - arrived in Kitimat and launching on Sept 1! Wishing them a great journey and a fulfilled purpose! Ryan is the son of longtime friends of mine...and I am very proud of him (them) taking on this journey! Kudoes to these three for standing up for what they believe in and making it happen! They are an inspiration to me!! :clap:

http://www.thepipedreamsproject.org/blog.html

http://www.thepipedreamsproject.org/index.html
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+1 on that ..good for those guys.
 
Re: The Pipedreams Project, BC's coast & the Enbridge Pipeli

The Pipedreams project Kayakers are expected home soon. Only a few more days. Planning a welcoming party at Jericho beach for them.... Arrival will depend on the weather- probably Monday or Tuesday- late afternoon. Tonight they are at Pender Harbour. They have come so far.... amazing. Left Kitimat on September 1. What a great job! :hug
 
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